Contributed by reader RC
I had a conversation with Mark Caguioa – remember him?
He’s the Barangay Ginebra Kings player from the Philippines, the “thug” as he was nicely labeled in Red Sports, who took a cheap shot at Kyle Jeffers during the dying minutes of the Slingers’ exhibition match against Ginebra prior to the ASEAN Basketball League (ABL) last year.
I ran into Mark last December while I was on holiday in Manila. I just walked up and introduced myself, and we had a very animated discussion on this incident.
Here’s his side.
Apparently when he was hitting his outside jumpers early in the game, Kyle planted a sharp shoulder from behind. Not sure if it was from a pick and roll, but Mark even demonstrated it to me – showing me an action where he had to lower his shoulder to do it. I would imagine, coming from someone from a guy Kyle’s size, that would have had to hurt.
So he turned around and asked Kyle why he did that, and Kyle barked back with a swear word. So after a series of “F-U” exchanges, Mark ended it with a threat – “I’m gonna get you man” which he repeated many times through the course of the game.
And we all know what he did and we can watch the replay several times – it was indeed intentional.
I think Kyle failed to realize two things: a) that Mark is a seasoned and high paid pro, having played in all levels including FIBA basketball and b) he is a FilAm (Filipino-American) which means he’s honed his game in the US.
But really, to these guys, it’s nothing – all part of the game and intimidation tactics. So enough said.
To see the story with pictures of the incident, go to: http://redsports.sg/2009/10/01/slingers-ginebra-caguioa-jeffers-basketball/
get over it guys, its over. its what basketball is all about..
grow up people, cry babies..geez..
I really think redsports screwed up in this article, redsports is not supposed to be biased and take stands. This is a really simple situation where a hard foul is committed, there is really no need to blow the matter over the top and call Mark a “Thug”. This happens often in professional leagues, and no one else has been called a “Thug”. Yes, he committed a technical/flagrant foul, but this does not mean people can flame him and call him a “Thug”. This is ridiculous. I think redsports is just unhappy over the Slingers’ loss.
@SM: This article? This article is written by a reader.
If you are referring to the other article which we linked to, that’s just the writer’s (mine) opinion.
Red Sports does not write stories. People write stories. And people are always biased and always take sides. And people are allowed their opinions in their stories.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, including your opinion that my opinion is not the right opinion.
@Kelvin – thanks and in no way does it clear Caguiao of his actions nor is meant to change how people perceive him as a result. It indicates there was cause, and what he did (right or wrong) was a result of that.
BTW – I don’t remember him getting an unsportsmanlike foul either for that call (even I cringed), so that should have been 2 shots plus ball and if I recall it would’ve turned into a one possession game if the ensuing play had the Slingers convert again. But that’s history.
Ever heard the adage, if you’re going to foul…foul hard. Its hard to know the difference between a genuine hard foul….and an intention to hurt someone. The one giving the foul knows, and everyone else guesses.
@ron
But there is one big difference…hardfouls can be questionable…throwing a punch or a “chop” has no defense in sports. So the entire article attempting to justify does seem flawed from the onset.
Actually I don’t see this contributed post from a reader as an attempt to justify the hack.
This post provides us all context cos at the time, we didn’t know what happened on court.
I think the writer is quite clear that Caguioa’s hack was not acceptable.
@moh – thanks for enlightening me about “hard fouls” and trying real hard to sound objective and unbiased.
I guess until you’re really at the receiving end of a hard foul, you’ll never know how to react and what’s really on either party’s minds. In the end it’s a spectator sport to us, but livelihood to them so there are different motivations.
Kelvin says EGO, and I agree. I would say I’d just give both players the benefit of the doubt.
Ron, if you don’t know the difference between a hard foul in the midst of the game that happens during a play and a pre-meditated blow to a player’s head then I can’t really explain it any more.
It seems to me that Kyle did not do it intentionally but of course I can’t prove it just as you can’t prove that he did do it intentionally. If it could be proven that he did it intentionally, then yes, Kyle would be a thug. If he were to come out and say it openly that he intentionally intended to hurt, then of course I would condemn it. The last thing I would do is write up a lame article trying to defend bad behaviour based on the word of a guy noone in their right mind should trust!! I think I have made myself plain now, haven’t I?
@moh – accdg to the story Jeffers initiated with a low shoulder blow to the blinside and even cursed Cagiuoa, so doesn’t that make Kyle a thug too? OK for Kyle to bully, but not OK for Mark to retaliate?
@Jhonny – I think the point was Kyle chose the wrong guy to bully, with Mark’s experience (all level play) and breeding (US), he obviously underestimated the Filipino.
Regardless or where you play or how highly you are paid….in any contact sports, there is a BIG difference between a hard foul executed in context of seeking an in game advantage and a dirty foul or cheap shot with intention to hurt. The player giving the foul and the player taking the foul (mostly) knows which is which. If they don’t…its mostly ego getting in the way…especially when they have had time to cool down, walk away from the situation and review.
Fans can make any arguments to rationalise their support for their teams and idols. Real sportsmen should know better.
Yeah man. PBA sucks now. Go ABL. We are all for the new Basketball League in SEA.
Haha, this has to be the most hilarious argument I have ever heard – some people will come up with any reason to defend a thug! He is openly and proudly saying that he chopped a guy on the head intentionally – imagine if a player in any other professional league came out openly and said that – he would be immediately fined.
Kyle failed to realize 2 things?? I think Kyle knows these 2 things and how do these 2 things support this guy’s case again? Haha, next time one player should just blindside another guy and punch his lights out giving him a concussion and some permanent brain damage – and then we can say ‘it’s nothing – all part of the game and intimidation tactics’ 🙂
What does it matter that he is high paid and Filipino American. He was just pissed and landed a cheap shot cause he got angry. Are u saying that because he honed his game in the US he is going to throw punches. your logic makes no sense. If what you say is true every high paid athelete who learned their sport in the States will throw punches. This article has little value anyways you can’t change the past. And everyone already knows why people punch people. If punching is really is really part of tactics then there is something seriously wrong with the PBA.